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we're here because we don't buy into the

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[\h__\h] of mainstream culture we're

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tired of the mundane passionless careers

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we've been shuffled into as a result of

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this orchestrated debt-based system of

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rule and the stranglehold on education

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entertainment by cold soulless

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corporations

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people yes we are frustrated yes we are

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tired

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and we reject the pre-approved

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tranquilizers that are monday night

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football and an ice cold budweiser we

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have to stop hiding

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stop hiding behind the headphones in the

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cherry popper 420 username

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let the world see that the resistance is

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strong and society is changing if there

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was a time to be anonymous but that time

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has passed

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and so the higher side chats would like

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to present conspiracies as the dawning

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of this new paradigm in the uniform of

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the revolution

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because bold fashion should mean more

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than some celebrity meat dress or frappe

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and a sleeping poem

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conspiracies redefines bold fashion as

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having the balls to project socially

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uncomfortable and unpopular truths from

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your radiant chest all [\h__\h] day

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conspirates.net

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let them know that you know bold designs

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in the 1930s

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the nation through a series of radio

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broadcasts known as the fireside chats

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his aim was to reassure the common man

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that our society would recover from its

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for a new era of worldly frustration we

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how's it going higher side chatters you

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know the routine drinking a little drink

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smoking a little smoke i'm greg carl

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wood and for all the uncertainty i have

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about reality and consciousness my core

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belief is that we'd gain much more

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knowledge of the world around us by

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examining the stranger aspects of life

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rather than dismissing them things like

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psychedelics out-of-body experience

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psychic ability and the behavior of

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other animals unfortunately most of

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today's highly respected academics and

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leading scientists operate in exactly

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the opposite manner and it's very rare

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to find someone strong-willed enough to

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absorb the education tools and intellect

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of the traditional academic system but

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remain free enough to openly explore the

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topics considered fringe are paranormal

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and today's guest rupert sheldrake is

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just such a rarity rupert sheldrake was

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a student of both harvard and cambridge

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with a phd in biochemistry and has

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authored numerous books and papers on a

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whole host of interesting topics i

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couldn't be more honored that he's going

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to spend some time with an idiot like me

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rupert welcome to the show and thanks

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for being here

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pleased to be with you

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man you have such an impressive body of

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work there's so many subjects we could

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talk about i know your book dogs that

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know when their owners are coming home

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it's over a decade old at this point but

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i've always been curious about animals

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and pets and i've always wondered how

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different our minds and consciousness

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and emotions are from them would you

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mind telling people a little bit about

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the research for that book and the

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unexplained power of animals that you

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found

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sure um incidentally a new edition came

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out last year so it was now a fully

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updated version of the book

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um

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well in the book i do deal with three

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main areas of unexplained plans of

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animals firstly telepathy

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secondly the sense of direction

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including homing pigeons and dogs and

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cats that find their way home over

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hundreds of miles

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and sadly premonitions the ability of

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many animals to

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apparently to foresee

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earthquakes tsunamis or other disasters

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and all of these are areas that we

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have researched that haven't really been

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done much with animals and all with

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people and they're all things that we

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share with animals we

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many humans are telepathic too

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people have a sense of direction

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but it's often not as good as that of

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animals and animals are better at

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premonitions so

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animals have abilities that we have too

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but too often to a lesser degree

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and when i was investigating these i

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went about it in

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two or three ways firstly i have a huge

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database of more than 5 000 case

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histories of stories

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from vets animal trainers horse riders

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hunters pet owners and so on

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about animals which is the natural

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history and this falls into a whole

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range of categories um

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secondly i do surveys to find out how

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common this behavior is and third

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experiments and the ones i've mainly

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investigated experimentally have been

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the ability of animals to know when

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their owners are coming home

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many dogs and cats and some horses and

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parrots and some other animals too

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know when a member of the family is

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coming home

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even if it's not a routine time even if

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they're not in a familiar vehicle and

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even if no one at home knows when

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they're coming they go they get excited

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or the dogs go and wait by the door or

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window

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sometimes ten minutes even half an hour

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before the person comes home

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so in our experiments we have people go

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at least five miles away

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um

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they come home at randomly chosen times

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we choose the time and let them know by

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its cell phone

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um they don't know in advance when

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they're going home they travel in

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unfamiliar vehicles the people at home

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don't know when they're coming and we

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film the place the dog waits the whole

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time the person's out

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and that way we have a full record of

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their behavior

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and we can tell that um over and over

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again they seem to know when the

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person's coming home

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long before the person arrives and in a

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way that can't be explained by sound or

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routine or people at home giving them

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clues

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but which seems to depend on picking up

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the intention of the person to come home

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in other words it seems to be telepathic

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right that's the most interesting part

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to me is that uh in your studies

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the the animal would get excited when

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the person stands up at their desk at

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work

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uh rather than you know

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when they're coming up the driveway

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because i definitely experience that

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with our dog if my if my girlfriend is

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parked

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a block away

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walking towards the house the dog

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definitely picks that up and i've had uh

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friends dismiss that as a keener sense

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of of hearing i'm like but you can't see

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through the door you don't know who that

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is walking up so it is a really

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interesting phenomenon i definitely

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think i experience it with my pets

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that they are they seem more in tune to

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certain things

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given some of those examples of the

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mental connection between pets and

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owners do you think that it's something

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that could be strengthened or developed

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well i think it's already very strong in

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some dogs and cats

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i don't know if anyone's actually tried

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to train it

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it seems to happen spontaneously in so

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many animals i don't know how you train

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it i suppose rewarding the dog for for

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um

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for giving a warning of someone coming

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would be one way but just paying

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attention is a kind of reward

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um

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so i think many people are

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as it were unconsciously training them

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anyway by paying attention to them

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um

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so i just don't know

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some are so good at it that you could

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hardly get get any better really yeah it

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seems like just a sixth sense but um i

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always thought cats were particularly

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interesting animals and i don't know if

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you've heard about the cat in that rhode

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island hospital but it seems to know

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when patients are gonna die and it

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spends the night with them before they

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go apparently it's pretty well

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documented in the hospital

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yes that case it has been well

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documented because you know one of the

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doctors actually studied this and wrote

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it up in in a paper in a medical journal

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and there are many other cases of cats

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that do that i in my book i describe

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several of them

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um

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they seem to know when people are going

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to die and

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it's surprising in in this case that

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it's people they don't know very well

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you know they're strangers really

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um

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but many animals know when their owners

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are sick or um

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have a problem and and they go and

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comfort them and it's one of the reasons

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that

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people get so attached to their pets

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because they really do seem to care

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and some dogs

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give warnings of epileptic seizures and

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they're very helpful to people with

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epilepsy because they give them warnings

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long before they can know

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themselves long before any other sign is

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available that a seizure is going to

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come on and it enables them to be in a

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safe place when it happens

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it's it's a phenomenal thing i tend to

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think that if animals can do it you know

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people should be able to do it do you

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think that this these abilities give

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some type of uh clues into what

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consciousness is what the mind is do you

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think there's a mechanism there

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well i think they do i think what they

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um

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telepathy normally occurs between people

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or animals that are closely bonded

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i think what they show is that the bonds

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the social bonds we have

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with people or with animals

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are real bonds they're real connections

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and

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i think they're mediated through what i

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call morphic fields

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and they stretch when people go away

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these bonds aren't broken they stretch

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and

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people remain connected at a distance

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that's why animals and people can quite

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often tell when someone they know

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has had an accident or even has died

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or when they when they need them or when

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they're going to come home

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because they're connected and i think

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these social bonds

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that connect still at a distance are the

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medium for telepathic connection or

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communication

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yeah it makes a lot of sense to me i

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hear

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some alternative speakers and thinkers

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and philosophers talking about

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consciousness existing outside of the

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body and it wasn't really until i heard

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about your morphic field that it sort of

285
00:10:29,430 --> 00:10:27,120
it painted a little bit easier picture

286
00:10:30,710 --> 00:10:29,440
for me to grasp and i i think it's a

287
00:10:32,630 --> 00:10:30,720
really interesting concept and it

288
00:10:34,710 --> 00:10:32,640
definitely explains some of these

289
00:10:36,949 --> 00:10:34,720
stranger aspects that uh

290
00:10:38,949 --> 00:10:36,959
the dogmatic scientists the traditional

291
00:10:42,310 --> 00:10:38,959
scientists tend to just ignore rather

292
00:10:44,150 --> 00:10:42,320
than explore which is really a shame

293
00:10:46,470 --> 00:10:44,160
well it certainly is i

294
00:10:48,389 --> 00:10:46,480
i think that the um

295
00:10:50,470 --> 00:10:48,399
the concept i'm keen is on is the

296
00:10:52,389 --> 00:10:50,480
extended mind the mind

297
00:10:54,710 --> 00:10:52,399
extending through fields beyond the

298
00:10:57,190 --> 00:10:54,720
brain we're used to the idea of fields

299
00:10:59,350 --> 00:10:57,200
inside magnets which stretch beyond the

300
00:11:02,069 --> 00:10:59,360
magnet or the field inside a cell phone

301
00:11:03,910 --> 00:11:02,079
that stretches beyond the cell phone um

302
00:11:05,829 --> 00:11:03,920
i think fields

303
00:11:08,310 --> 00:11:05,839
of my of the mind are in our brains and

304
00:11:10,630 --> 00:11:08,320
stretch beyond them i think when we look

305
00:11:13,110 --> 00:11:10,640
at something uh the image we're seeing

306
00:11:15,110 --> 00:11:13,120
is projected out by the eyes to where it

307
00:11:16,550 --> 00:11:15,120
seems to be and our minds connect with

308
00:11:18,550 --> 00:11:16,560
what we're looking at

309
00:11:21,190 --> 00:11:18,560
and that is the basis of what i call the

310
00:11:23,190 --> 00:11:21,200
sense of being stared at um incidentally

311
00:11:24,790 --> 00:11:23,200
my book called that the sense of being

312
00:11:27,350 --> 00:11:24,800
stared at is coming out in the new

313
00:11:29,670 --> 00:11:27,360
edition in a couple of weeks

314
00:11:31,350 --> 00:11:29,680
so the extended mind

315
00:11:33,509 --> 00:11:31,360
is i think better than the idea of the

316
00:11:35,509 --> 00:11:33,519
non-local mind or the mind outside the

317
00:11:37,509 --> 00:11:35,519
brain because i don't think the mind is

318
00:11:39,110 --> 00:11:37,519
just kind of free-floating nowhere in

319
00:11:41,190 --> 00:11:39,120
particular i think our minds are

320
00:11:42,630 --> 00:11:41,200
normally rooted in our brains just as

321
00:11:45,030 --> 00:11:42,640
they seem to be

322
00:11:46,069 --> 00:11:45,040
but they extend much beyond them which

323
00:11:48,389 --> 00:11:46,079
is why

324
00:11:50,310 --> 00:11:48,399
attention and intention can have effects

325
00:11:52,150 --> 00:11:50,320
at a distance

326
00:11:54,150 --> 00:11:52,160
now i know you've done a whole lot of

327
00:11:56,870 --> 00:11:54,160
work with plants that was uh in your

328
00:11:58,790 --> 00:11:56,880
early career do you think plants have a

329
00:12:00,310 --> 00:11:58,800
consciousness and trees have a type of

330
00:12:02,630 --> 00:12:00,320
consciousness i know there's been some

331
00:12:04,870 --> 00:12:02,640
alternative studies in that area

332
00:12:06,470 --> 00:12:04,880
well i think they have

333
00:12:08,629 --> 00:12:06,480
i think they have morphic fields that

334
00:12:10,790 --> 00:12:08,639
organize their form what plants mainly

335
00:12:13,910 --> 00:12:10,800
do is grow and

336
00:12:16,710 --> 00:12:13,920
the shape they grow in depends on

337
00:12:19,190 --> 00:12:16,720
a form shaping field which is called a

338
00:12:21,670 --> 00:12:19,200
morphogenetic field it's um to do with

339
00:12:23,829 --> 00:12:21,680
morphogenesis the development of form

340
00:12:26,949 --> 00:12:23,839
it's one kind of morphic field which are

341
00:12:28,710 --> 00:12:26,959
these shaping fields that i think shape

342
00:12:30,150 --> 00:12:28,720
everything in nature and contain a kind

343
00:12:32,310 --> 00:12:30,160
of memory

344
00:12:34,150 --> 00:12:32,320
so i think plants do have a kind of

345
00:12:36,389 --> 00:12:34,160
memory i do think they have a kind of

346
00:12:38,550 --> 00:12:36,399
rather mind-like field

347
00:12:41,110 --> 00:12:38,560
but i don't doubt if they're conscious

348
00:12:42,790 --> 00:12:41,120
in the same sense we're conscious um

349
00:12:44,790 --> 00:12:42,800
you know we our own consciousness is

350
00:12:47,350 --> 00:12:44,800
shaped by language and

351
00:12:50,710 --> 00:12:47,360
as animals we have the ability to move

352
00:12:52,870 --> 00:12:50,720
around and all animals

353
00:12:55,509 --> 00:12:52,880
have brains that control their muscular

354
00:12:57,350 --> 00:12:55,519
systems what plants don't do there that

355
00:12:59,910 --> 00:12:57,360
what they do is have an awareness of

356
00:13:02,470 --> 00:12:59,920
gravity and light and which are the main

357
00:13:05,110 --> 00:13:02,480
things that concern them and

358
00:13:07,509 --> 00:13:05,120
and they grow uh towards the light or

359
00:13:10,389 --> 00:13:07,519
away from the light in the case of roots

360
00:13:12,310 --> 00:13:10,399
um so i think their minds and so far as

361
00:13:14,150 --> 00:13:12,320
they have minds are primarily concerned

362
00:13:15,829 --> 00:13:14,160
with things like gravity light and

363
00:13:16,629 --> 00:13:15,839
growth and form

364
00:13:17,430 --> 00:13:16,639
um

365
00:13:19,350 --> 00:13:17,440
and

366
00:13:22,150 --> 00:13:19,360
would be very hard for us to recognize

367
00:13:23,190 --> 00:13:22,160
as minds if we were able to get inside a

368
00:13:25,590 --> 00:13:23,200
plant

369
00:13:27,110 --> 00:13:25,600
but they do communicate with our minds

370
00:13:28,389 --> 00:13:27,120
and

371
00:13:30,150 --> 00:13:28,399
there's a sense in which plants

372
00:13:32,629 --> 00:13:30,160
communicate with animals all the time

373
00:13:34,470 --> 00:13:32,639
and flowers after all in fruits

374
00:13:37,350 --> 00:13:34,480
are a kind of communication would be no

375
00:13:39,190 --> 00:13:37,360
point in a plant forming a flower

376
00:13:41,670 --> 00:13:39,200
if there was any it wasn't an animal to

377
00:13:44,150 --> 00:13:41,680
see it unless it's a wind-pollinated

378
00:13:45,750 --> 00:13:44,160
flower but most of the coloured flowers

379
00:13:47,110 --> 00:13:45,760
and the scented flowers that we have in

380
00:13:49,829 --> 00:13:47,120
our gardens

381
00:13:51,590 --> 00:13:49,839
um are there because plants have evolved

382
00:13:53,829 --> 00:13:51,600
them in a kind of communication or

383
00:13:55,269 --> 00:13:53,839
dialogue with animals

384
00:13:57,910 --> 00:13:55,279
and

385
00:13:59,990 --> 00:13:57,920
i mean dog one in one of his rare poetic

386
00:14:01,829 --> 00:14:00,000
moments darwin said

387
00:14:03,990 --> 00:14:01,839
there could have been no flour until

388
00:14:05,269 --> 00:14:04,000
there was an eye to see it

389
00:14:07,189 --> 00:14:05,279
and

390
00:14:09,350 --> 00:14:07,199
so you see there that's an interaction

391
00:14:11,350 --> 00:14:09,360
of fruits and interaction too plants

392
00:14:13,990 --> 00:14:11,360
produce fruits that smell

393
00:14:16,150 --> 00:14:14,000
good taste good look good

394
00:14:18,069 --> 00:14:16,160
precisely because they attract animals

395
00:14:20,069 --> 00:14:18,079
if it wasn't for animals they wouldn't

396
00:14:20,949 --> 00:14:20,079
bother producing fruits

397
00:14:22,550 --> 00:14:20,959
um

398
00:14:24,629 --> 00:14:22,560
and they also of course produce

399
00:14:27,590 --> 00:14:24,639
chemicals which um

400
00:14:29,670 --> 00:14:27,600
give flavor to things like mint and

401
00:14:31,910 --> 00:14:29,680
you know all the herbs and spices and of

402
00:14:33,030 --> 00:14:31,920
course they also produce psychoactive

403
00:14:35,509 --> 00:14:33,040
chemicals

404
00:14:37,670 --> 00:14:35,519
as in the case of cannabis ayahuasca and

405
00:14:40,389 --> 00:14:37,680
so forth the the plants that make up

406
00:14:41,990 --> 00:14:40,399
ayahuasca well why they do that

407
00:14:44,470 --> 00:14:42,000
who knows these are things which have

408
00:14:47,189 --> 00:14:44,480
powerful effects on animals

409
00:14:48,790 --> 00:14:47,199
including humans

410
00:14:51,910 --> 00:14:48,800
and these are another form of

411
00:14:53,910 --> 00:14:51,920
communication between plants and animals

412
00:14:55,910 --> 00:14:53,920
so i think there's a whole lot of

413
00:14:58,069 --> 00:14:55,920
dialogues going on between plants and

414
00:14:59,110 --> 00:14:58,079
animals but they're usually taking place

415
00:15:02,710 --> 00:14:59,120
through

416
00:15:04,389 --> 00:15:02,720
you know smells colors chemicals

417
00:15:05,590 --> 00:15:04,399
tastes and so on

418
00:15:08,629 --> 00:15:05,600
that's really interesting i never

419
00:15:10,470 --> 00:15:08,639
thought about about flowers and uh

420
00:15:12,710 --> 00:15:10,480
and fruits as a type of communication

421
00:15:15,269 --> 00:15:12,720
but it just it's just about changing

422
00:15:16,870 --> 00:15:15,279
your definition of communication really

423
00:15:19,910 --> 00:15:16,880
yeah i think that makes a lot of sense

424
00:15:21,829 --> 00:15:19,920
but to segue into another topic

425
00:15:23,910 --> 00:15:21,839
let me say i became familiar with your

426
00:15:25,829 --> 00:15:23,920
work due to the crossovers and

427
00:15:27,590 --> 00:15:25,839
conversations you had with terence

428
00:15:29,189 --> 00:15:27,600
mckenna who have always considered one

429
00:15:31,910 --> 00:15:29,199
of my favorite minds

430
00:15:34,150 --> 00:15:31,920
and as graham hancock who's ted talk

431
00:15:35,189 --> 00:15:34,160
also faced the same banning controversy

432
00:15:37,030 --> 00:15:35,199
as yours

433
00:15:38,870 --> 00:15:37,040
i sometimes wonder if it's the

434
00:15:40,629 --> 00:15:38,880
experiences with psychedelics that

435
00:15:43,350 --> 00:15:40,639
fertilize the minds of some great

436
00:15:45,430 --> 00:15:43,360
scholars to entertain the less

437
00:15:47,350 --> 00:15:45,440
conventional theories and study fringe

438
00:15:50,069 --> 00:15:47,360
subject material do you think that has

439
00:15:52,829 --> 00:15:50,079
anything to do with it

440
00:15:55,670 --> 00:15:52,839
i think it could have

441
00:15:56,949 --> 00:15:55,680
yes i wouldn't like to say

442
00:15:59,110 --> 00:15:56,959
it always does because there's a lot of

443
00:16:01,509 --> 00:15:59,120
people who are just naturally creative

444
00:16:05,829 --> 00:16:01,519
and who don't seem to

445
00:16:09,350 --> 00:16:07,749
and there are some people who take

446
00:16:11,110 --> 00:16:09,360
psychedelics who are completely

447
00:16:12,230 --> 00:16:11,120
conventional in their outer life you

448
00:16:13,749 --> 00:16:12,240
know

449
00:16:15,430 --> 00:16:13,759
there are quite a number of scientists

450
00:16:17,350 --> 00:16:15,440
who um

451
00:16:19,350 --> 00:16:17,360
to all intents and purposes when you

452
00:16:22,150 --> 00:16:19,360
visit them in the lab they just look

453
00:16:23,749 --> 00:16:22,160
like regular guys but um behind the

454
00:16:25,430 --> 00:16:23,759
scenes they're interested in

455
00:16:26,790 --> 00:16:25,440
psychedelics they have psychic

456
00:16:30,069 --> 00:16:26,800
experiences

457
00:16:32,629 --> 00:16:30,079
science is full of closet um psychedelic

458
00:16:35,269 --> 00:16:32,639
takers and and people with psychic

459
00:16:37,030 --> 00:16:35,279
powers and spiritual interests it's just

460
00:16:38,870 --> 00:16:37,040
that within the culture of science most

461
00:16:41,030 --> 00:16:38,880
people don't feel free to talk about it

462
00:16:42,389 --> 00:16:41,040
to their colleagues but

463
00:16:43,590 --> 00:16:42,399
you know in a sense i'm out of the

464
00:16:45,189 --> 00:16:43,600
closet so

465
00:16:47,110 --> 00:16:45,199
a lot of scientists talk to me about

466
00:16:49,829 --> 00:16:47,120
their experiences

467
00:16:51,189 --> 00:16:49,839
in private um but most of their

468
00:16:53,990 --> 00:16:51,199
colleagues wouldn't have the faintest

469
00:16:55,829 --> 00:16:54,000
idea that they have deviant views

470
00:16:57,990 --> 00:16:55,839
because in public they

471
00:17:00,150 --> 00:16:58,000
they try to pretend to be completely

472
00:17:01,910 --> 00:17:00,160
conventional and straight that's a

473
00:17:05,669 --> 00:17:01,920
common feature of science and it's a

474
00:17:07,590 --> 00:17:05,679
great shame actually because

475
00:17:09,590 --> 00:17:07,600
most scientists aren't as boring as the

476
00:17:10,470 --> 00:17:09,600
official view of science makes science

477
00:17:12,309 --> 00:17:10,480
look

478
00:17:15,350 --> 00:17:12,319
and

479
00:17:16,789 --> 00:17:15,360
but they're very afraid of of coming out

480
00:17:18,309 --> 00:17:16,799
of the closet or

481
00:17:20,390 --> 00:17:18,319
making their colleagues think they're at

482
00:17:22,069 --> 00:17:20,400
all weird in their interests because

483
00:17:24,069 --> 00:17:22,079
they're afraid they'll lose their grants

484
00:17:25,590 --> 00:17:24,079
or their jobs or their reputation or

485
00:17:27,270 --> 00:17:25,600
something like that

486
00:17:29,750 --> 00:17:27,280
i think that science will change

487
00:17:31,350 --> 00:17:29,760
dramatically when scientists feel free

488
00:17:33,270 --> 00:17:31,360
to come out of the closet and talk to

489
00:17:35,190 --> 00:17:33,280
their colleagues at work

490
00:17:36,549 --> 00:17:35,200
um about the things that really interest

491
00:17:38,390 --> 00:17:36,559
them

492
00:17:39,669 --> 00:17:38,400
yeah i guess uh with psychedelics it's

493
00:17:41,430 --> 00:17:39,679
kind of a chicken or an egg kind of

494
00:17:43,510 --> 00:17:41,440
thing it's you well usually it's

495
00:17:45,270 --> 00:17:43,520
probably the inquisitive mind would

496
00:17:47,270 --> 00:17:45,280
entertain psychedelics already rather

497
00:17:48,870 --> 00:17:47,280
rather than the rigid mind who would

498
00:17:50,630 --> 00:17:48,880
dismiss them as uh

499
00:17:51,669 --> 00:17:50,640
you know party favors

500
00:17:53,430 --> 00:17:51,679
yes

501
00:17:55,750 --> 00:17:53,440
um but you know i mentioned your your

502
00:17:58,870 --> 00:17:55,760
ted talk and this is kind of what we're

503
00:18:02,789 --> 00:17:58,880
talking about um the material in science

504
00:18:03,990 --> 00:18:02,799
set free the dogma of of science to not

505
00:18:06,070 --> 00:18:04,000
look at the

506
00:18:07,510 --> 00:18:06,080
stranger aspects of life you've been

507
00:18:09,590 --> 00:18:07,520
working on this it seems like graham

508
00:18:11,750 --> 00:18:09,600
hancock's doing the same similar thing

509
00:18:14,630 --> 00:18:11,760
talking about the dogma of history and

510
00:18:17,190 --> 00:18:14,640
the dogma of looking back at some of the

511
00:18:19,110 --> 00:18:17,200
structures we have and re-examining the

512
00:18:21,750 --> 00:18:19,120
timeline of humanity

513
00:18:23,830 --> 00:18:21,760
terence kind of did this in the dogma of

514
00:18:25,190 --> 00:18:23,840
the social structure trying to challenge

515
00:18:27,350 --> 00:18:25,200
that

516
00:18:29,669 --> 00:18:27,360
i feel like you guys are all

517
00:18:32,390 --> 00:18:29,679
doing similar things to challenge the

518
00:18:33,990 --> 00:18:32,400
paradigm in just different areas and i

519
00:18:36,150 --> 00:18:34,000
love it that's one of my favorite things

520
00:18:38,390 --> 00:18:36,160
i feel like that's what brings new ideas

521
00:18:40,310 --> 00:18:38,400
to my mind and uh

522
00:18:42,230 --> 00:18:40,320
without it i mean what are we really

523
00:18:44,150 --> 00:18:42,240
learning

524
00:18:46,310 --> 00:18:44,160
well i agree um

525
00:18:47,110 --> 00:18:46,320
and again i think there are many people

526
00:18:49,029 --> 00:18:47,120
who

527
00:18:50,710 --> 00:18:49,039
actually are interested in these things

528
00:18:52,310 --> 00:18:50,720
even though you never get it from their

529
00:18:53,990 --> 00:18:52,320
public persona

530
00:18:56,549 --> 00:18:54,000
and there's a lot going on behind the

531
00:19:01,029 --> 00:18:58,150
i think the interesting thing about the

532
00:19:02,789 --> 00:19:01,039
ted controversy was that ted took down

533
00:19:07,029 --> 00:19:02,799
my talk in graham hancock's from the

534
00:19:09,830 --> 00:19:07,039
tedx site in response to protests by

535
00:19:12,470 --> 00:19:09,840
very reactionary figures that pz mars

536
00:19:14,150 --> 00:19:12,480
and and jerry coyne the human militant

537
00:19:15,270 --> 00:19:14,160
atheist bloggers

538
00:19:17,110 --> 00:19:15,280
um

539
00:19:19,029 --> 00:19:17,120
i think they behaved hastily and i think

540
00:19:22,230 --> 00:19:19,039
they'd come to regret it i had a talk

541
00:19:24,230 --> 00:19:22,240
with chris anderson who runs ted

542
00:19:26,630 --> 00:19:24,240
on the telephone during that crisis and

543
00:19:28,230 --> 00:19:26,640
he spoke for half an hour or so and he

544
00:19:29,110 --> 00:19:28,240
was very friendly

545
00:19:31,110 --> 00:19:29,120
and

546
00:19:32,710 --> 00:19:31,120
i got the impression he rather regretted

547
00:19:34,230 --> 00:19:32,720
that they'd taken this decision once

548
00:19:35,029 --> 00:19:34,240
they'd taken it they had to stick with

549
00:19:36,070 --> 00:19:35,039
it

550
00:19:45,590 --> 00:19:36,080
um

551
00:19:47,350 --> 00:19:45,600
told me last week that he'd interviewed

552
00:19:49,430 --> 00:19:47,360
chris anderson recently and chris

553
00:19:51,590 --> 00:19:49,440
anderson said as a result of all this

554
00:19:52,390 --> 00:19:51,600
controversy over my book science set

555
00:19:54,150 --> 00:19:52,400
free

556
00:19:54,870 --> 00:19:54,160
he actually bought a copy and has read

557
00:19:56,470 --> 00:19:54,880
it

558
00:19:58,630 --> 00:19:56,480
and um

559
00:20:00,310 --> 00:19:58,640
and apparently really enjoyed it and and

560
00:20:01,909 --> 00:20:00,320
found it gave him a whole new way of

561
00:20:02,950 --> 00:20:01,919
looking at things so

562
00:20:05,029 --> 00:20:02,960
um

563
00:20:08,230 --> 00:20:05,039
i don't think anderson himself is

564
00:20:10,630 --> 00:20:08,240
necessarily stuck into this old

565
00:20:12,549 --> 00:20:10,640
mindset some of the people around him

566
00:20:14,470 --> 00:20:12,559
are and he's

567
00:20:16,710 --> 00:20:14,480
under pressure from some of these very

568
00:20:19,750 --> 00:20:16,720
reactionary forces

569
00:20:21,909 --> 00:20:19,760
in the scientific world

570
00:20:23,590 --> 00:20:21,919
i think he he has the potential to be

571
00:20:25,830 --> 00:20:23,600
considerably more open as a matter of

572
00:20:27,830 --> 00:20:25,840
fact i hope that that will be reflected

573
00:20:29,830 --> 00:20:27,840
in the future direction of ted and ted

574
00:20:31,990 --> 00:20:29,840
talks so it might all have done some

575
00:20:34,230 --> 00:20:32,000
good in the end right

576
00:20:36,230 --> 00:20:34,240
it certainly was helpful in spreading

577
00:20:38,310 --> 00:20:36,240
ideas this controversy but i think it

578
00:20:41,430 --> 00:20:38,320
might also have done something to

579
00:20:42,950 --> 00:20:41,440
to lighten up ted itself

580
00:20:44,789 --> 00:20:42,960
yeah um

581
00:20:46,789 --> 00:20:44,799
i i think they it definitely had the

582
00:20:49,190 --> 00:20:46,799
reverse effect i mean if they would have

583
00:20:51,510 --> 00:20:49,200
just left it alone it would have been

584
00:20:53,270 --> 00:20:51,520
amongst all these ted talks there would

585
00:20:56,070 --> 00:20:53,280
have been nothing uh

586
00:20:57,990 --> 00:20:56,080
anomalous about it but by by drawing all

587
00:20:59,830 --> 00:20:58,000
this attention specifically to you and

588
00:21:01,669 --> 00:20:59,840
graham hancock by

589
00:21:03,909 --> 00:21:01,679
censoring your talks i mean they're now

590
00:21:05,350 --> 00:21:03,919
what everybody talks about as far as ted

591
00:21:07,430 --> 00:21:05,360
talks are concerned i think the biggest

592
00:21:08,950 --> 00:21:07,440
conversation going around is this bit of

593
00:21:11,110 --> 00:21:08,960
censorship and then everybody goes

594
00:21:13,830 --> 00:21:11,120
online to watch these two specific talks

595
00:21:16,789 --> 00:21:13,840
over other ones yeah i know so before

596
00:21:19,430 --> 00:21:16,799
they banned my talk it had 35 000 views

597
00:21:22,070 --> 00:21:19,440
and it's now had at least 500 thousand

598
00:21:24,070 --> 00:21:22,080
so i mean it's certainly um

599
00:21:25,830 --> 00:21:24,080
being completely counterproductive from

600
00:21:27,750 --> 00:21:25,840
their point of view

601
00:21:30,070 --> 00:21:27,760
funny how it works out um the universe

602
00:21:31,669 --> 00:21:30,080
works in mysterious ways but yeah

603
00:21:33,350 --> 00:21:31,679
there is a lot of good material in that

604
00:21:34,870 --> 00:21:33,360
talking i would and if we had more time

605
00:21:37,190 --> 00:21:34,880
i'd love to discuss the details and

606
00:21:38,630 --> 00:21:37,200
examples of it but a side note that i

607
00:21:40,230 --> 00:21:38,640
found interesting

608
00:21:41,750 --> 00:21:40,240
was that you made the presentation

609
00:21:44,390 --> 00:21:41,760
barefoot

610
00:21:46,549 --> 00:21:44,400
what was the motivation behind that

611
00:21:49,110 --> 00:21:46,559
i don't know um

612
00:21:51,990 --> 00:21:49,120
the organizers of this event had created

613
00:21:54,149 --> 00:21:52,000
a kind of mossy platform on the stage

614
00:21:56,549 --> 00:21:54,159
and they asked all the presenters to do

615
00:21:58,950 --> 00:21:56,559
it barefoot so it wasn't me

616
00:22:00,950 --> 00:21:58,960
being eccentric or with some peculiar

617
00:22:03,510 --> 00:22:00,960
idiosyncrasy i was just following the

618
00:22:05,510 --> 00:22:03,520
house rules oh that's so funny i've

619
00:22:07,990 --> 00:22:05,520
never been in a ted event before for all

620
00:22:09,430 --> 00:22:08,000
i knew all ted talks were barefoot so i

621
00:22:11,029 --> 00:22:09,440
you know i just did it because they said

622
00:22:12,710 --> 00:22:11,039
this is what this is the way we're doing

623
00:22:14,870 --> 00:22:12,720
it would you mind taking your shoes off

624
00:22:16,070 --> 00:22:14,880
and standing on this moss nice to me

625
00:22:18,789 --> 00:22:16,080
that's fine

626
00:22:20,710 --> 00:22:18,799
but when the ted talk was screened on

627
00:22:23,270 --> 00:22:20,720
stage quite a few people thought that i

628
00:22:25,510 --> 00:22:23,280
i had some kind of peculiar thing about

629
00:22:27,590 --> 00:22:25,520
being barefoot i like being barefoot and

630
00:22:28,390 --> 00:22:27,600
it's nice standing on moss and stuff but

631
00:22:31,669 --> 00:22:28,400
um

632
00:22:33,270 --> 00:22:31,679
i i can't claim that it was my own idea

633
00:22:34,470 --> 00:22:33,280
well the reason i even bring it up is

634
00:22:36,710 --> 00:22:34,480
because there are a lot of people who

635
00:22:39,350 --> 00:22:36,720
talk about energy and electrical charges

636
00:22:41,590 --> 00:22:39,360
and they utilize products like grounding

637
00:22:44,149 --> 00:22:41,600
mats and they recommend walking barefoot

638
00:22:45,750 --> 00:22:44,159
on grass to discharge the static buildup

639
00:22:47,270 --> 00:22:45,760
of the body and i'm not sure

640
00:22:49,430 --> 00:22:47,280
i mean what i

641
00:22:51,029 --> 00:22:49,440
think about that i've never i don't know

642
00:22:53,270 --> 00:22:51,039
but do you think there's any validity to

643
00:22:55,029 --> 00:22:53,280
those kind of things

644
00:22:57,270 --> 00:22:55,039
well i certainly think it feels more

645
00:22:58,789 --> 00:22:57,280
natural walking barefoot and you know

646
00:23:00,950 --> 00:22:58,799
there have been periods in my life when

647
00:23:03,029 --> 00:23:00,960
i have done it when i lived in india in

648
00:23:05,590 --> 00:23:03,039
a village in south india i

649
00:23:07,590 --> 00:23:05,600
was barefoot quite a lot of the time and

650
00:23:10,070 --> 00:23:07,600
but of course you have to harden up your

651
00:23:12,950 --> 00:23:10,080
feet i mean if i do it now i could just

652
00:23:14,230 --> 00:23:12,960
be quite painful in those circumstances

653
00:23:15,990 --> 00:23:14,240
um

654
00:23:18,470 --> 00:23:16,000
yeah i think i mean i have no idea

655
00:23:20,789 --> 00:23:18,480
whether one absorbs energies but it

656
00:23:22,950 --> 00:23:20,799
certainly feels more natural to do that

657
00:23:24,870 --> 00:23:22,960
and it does give a greater sense of

658
00:23:27,110 --> 00:23:24,880
connection

659
00:23:29,029 --> 00:23:27,120
interesting well i know you need to get

660
00:23:30,630 --> 00:23:29,039
going it's been

661
00:23:32,950 --> 00:23:30,640
great to be able to bounce some of my

662
00:23:35,590 --> 00:23:32,960
weirdo questions off of someone that i

663
00:23:37,510 --> 00:23:35,600
admire uh the reality that the

664
00:23:39,029 --> 00:23:37,520
scientific community is dogmatic and

665
00:23:41,029 --> 00:23:39,039
stuck within an established rigid

666
00:23:43,270 --> 00:23:41,039
paradigm is definitely not new to

667
00:23:45,430 --> 00:23:43,280
listeners of this show it's actually

668
00:23:47,029 --> 00:23:45,440
uh probably the fact that contributes to

669
00:23:48,630 --> 00:23:47,039
the success of the show because people

670
00:23:50,470 --> 00:23:48,640
are hungry to hear about things that

671
00:23:52,549 --> 00:23:50,480
conventionalists won't touch

672
00:23:54,070 --> 00:23:52,559
and because the establishment isn't

673
00:23:56,390 --> 00:23:54,080
doing it they got to look somewhere else

674
00:23:57,990 --> 00:23:56,400
but you know your latest work is doing a

675
00:23:59,990 --> 00:23:58,000
great job in breaking it down and

676
00:24:02,470 --> 00:24:00,000
hopefully turning a lot of young

677
00:24:04,549 --> 00:24:02,480
scientific minds which is crucial and i

678
00:24:05,669 --> 00:24:04,559
applaud that path but is there anything

679
00:24:06,950 --> 00:24:05,679
else you're working on or any other

680
00:24:08,950 --> 00:24:06,960
information you'd like to leave the

681
00:24:10,789 --> 00:24:08,960
people with maybe your website

682
00:24:13,350 --> 00:24:10,799
oh yes definitely take a look at my

683
00:24:16,390 --> 00:24:13,360
website sheldrake.org

684
00:24:19,190 --> 00:24:16,400
and i have an online

685
00:24:21,590 --> 00:24:19,200
at least a self and telepathy test and

686
00:24:23,909 --> 00:24:21,600
other tests online at the online

687
00:24:25,350 --> 00:24:23,919
experiments portal so any who wants

688
00:24:27,590 --> 00:24:25,360
anyone who wants to try out an

689
00:24:30,870 --> 00:24:27,600
experiment for themselves you know do

690
00:24:33,430 --> 00:24:30,880
have a go awesome that is very cool um

691
00:24:35,269 --> 00:24:33,440
well rupert good sir i'm just thankful i

692
00:24:37,830 --> 00:24:35,279
was able to form full sentences in your

693
00:24:39,110 --> 00:24:37,840
presence uh thanks for being here i

694
00:24:40,470 --> 00:24:39,120
appreciate your time and i know that

695
00:24:41,830 --> 00:24:40,480
people do too

696
00:24:44,789 --> 00:24:41,840
take care and keep fighting the good

697
00:24:47,029 --> 00:24:44,799
fight guys my pleasure all the best bye

698
00:24:49,190 --> 00:24:47,039
bye there we go people a little shorter

699
00:24:50,870 --> 00:24:49,200
than most episodes of thc but i'm a big

700
00:24:52,390 --> 00:24:50,880
fan of rupert sheldrick and i'm happy to

701
00:24:54,149 --> 00:24:52,400
have talked to him for any amount of

702
00:24:55,669 --> 00:24:54,159
time please share this show with your

703
00:24:57,750 --> 00:24:55,679
people if you found it interesting and

704
00:24:58,630 --> 00:24:57,760
review us on itunes that's always a huge

705
00:25:00,470 --> 00:24:58,640
help

706
00:25:02,390 --> 00:25:00,480
and you can support and sustain my life

707
00:25:04,549 --> 00:25:02,400
with the purchase of one of many

708
00:25:06,870 --> 00:25:04,559
t-shirts offered to conspiracies.net i

709
00:25:08,470 --> 00:25:06,880
got two new designs coming very soon

710
00:25:09,990 --> 00:25:08,480
anyway you guys are great thanks for the

711
00:25:11,909 --> 00:25:10,000
support the show is growing like a

712
00:25:14,390 --> 00:25:11,919
pesticide resistant strain of good

713
00:25:16,549 --> 00:25:14,400
old-fashioned monsanto corn and that's

714
00:25:18,549 --> 00:25:16,559
fast and we'll be back next week with

715
00:25:20,390 --> 00:25:18,559
jeff berwick the dollar vigilante to

716
00:25:22,310 --> 00:25:20,400
learn how to internationalize ourselves

717
00:25:25,110 --> 00:25:22,320
to avoid going down the ship we call the

718
00:25:26,230 --> 00:25:25,120
uss economy i suspect we might learn

719
00:25:28,070 --> 00:25:26,240
something

720
00:25:30,710 --> 00:25:28,080
in the meantime take care of yourself

721
00:25:32,789 --> 00:25:30,720
enjoy some good vices and walk barefoot